www.cowries.info

[Notocypraea]

G'day,

I am interested in reliable information on some of the extreme Southern & Northern collecting records for Cypraea.

For example a friend of mine collected two live vitellus intertidally from a rock pool in Merimbula, far southern New South Wales, Australia (not far North of the border with Victoria). This was in January 2009. Over several years he would occasionally see a dead/ fresh dead specimen.

I also know someone who collected Cypraea scurra alive in Sydney Harbour, Sydney, central New South Wales, Australia

The furtherest south I have ever collected a cowrie (live Notocypraea comptonii) was in Port Arthur, Southern Tasmania.
The furtherest north I have ever collected a cowrie (milaris & gracilus) was off an island not far south of Shanghai in China (East China sea).

Interesting.


Regards,
Simon

[Peskadot]

Good Evening Notocypraea,

For what it is worth, we have collected a few fresh dead specimens of C. irrorata in the Northern Mariana Islands. This seems to be well north of their normal range. They may have been "dropped" here by a passing fish, as we have yet to see a live specimen.

[benicypraea]

Hello all:

Some people told to me that Schilderia achatidea is one of the two rare cowries that is possible to find in Northwestern Spain, in the cold and dangerous Cantabric Sea.
Even A friend of mine remember to find a beached spurca some years ago in a beach from Asturias, Northern Spain, after a storm.
I also remember that I have read in a paper that Raybaudi had in his huge collection a rare gem specimen of achatidea coming from Cascais, Portugal. I don´t have many news about these rare findings there in the Atlantic. I have seen a second specimen coming from Portugal in an italian collection. Any news about these findings are welcome.
Curiously, the allied cowry known as Simnia spelta have been found alive in gorgoniaceans there in northern Spain, and is not very rare there...
Maybe someday I will meet a local collector from there with real achatidea or spurca collected in Northern Spain, why not?
Regards,
Beni
_________________
I started to collect seashells since my childhood but I decided to focus on cowries in 1990. I like all kind of cowries, freaks, normal, nigers, dwarfs...
Also I collect conidae and Muricidae.

[Guest]

Good evening Beni - what is northern Spain?

1. specialists recognise 2 forms of Schilderia achatidea:
- Schilderia achatidea achatidea - mediterrannean
- Schilderia achatidea inopinata - west Africa
(the differences are rather subtle if You have one of each - cfr. checklist of living cypraeidea - and easier to recognise with larger series - as usual).

2.what is northern Spain?
-A. the northern Spanish coastline is horizontal from atlantic in the west to Biscaia/Cantabria (SanSebastian - France) in the east ,
-B. the southern Spanish coastline goes from the atlantic border with Portugal in the south-west over Gibraltar into the mediterrannean sea oblique over Malaga en Alicante to the border with France in the north-east. This north-eastern part of themediterrannean coast of Spain is erroneously sometimes called northern or north-eastern coast of Spain so giving rise to confusion with the real northern (atlantic) coast of Spain .

3.the find of western african achatidea in boats of portugese or even spanish fishermen,returning from (mostly net) fishing along the west african coast (as deep as Senegal?) is wel known(together with lots of different cymbium,ampulla priamus,murex saharicus and murex bojadorensis,cardium costatum,a.s.o.) as wel in Cascais,in Malaga and in Alicante(personal experience PVDB, and others Ch.Geerts).Sometimes too there are rather important numbers of mediterrannean achatidea to find in fishermen "shops" in Malaga or Alicante. On one single occasion -returning every year to my "good shell finding/trading/bying places" in Malaga, I had the feeling that a bulck of shells containing achatidea, bought from a long time known fisherman comprised both populations: "all found in Malaga by himself, murex bojadorensis included!"He forgot to tell : all found by myself in Malaga in different fishermen boats returning from different fishing places.

4.I never heard about reliable finds of schilderia achatidea from northern atlantic coast of Spain, certainly not in Cantabrian/Biscaian sea.But bonito (line-fishing) fishermen or other (bottom net-fishing,clam fishing or lobster traps setting) fishermen sail far and it is never impossible that they bring achatidea between other"sea things" within their regular catch.

Kind regards from PVDB.

[Sleepycat]

[benicypraea]

Dear PVDB:

Concerning achatidea in Northern Spain (Cantabrian Sea) I will try to find info. I know that this is a very hard finding there, but also I think that this is not impossible. I remember to hear about this cowry coming from there, but not the ones collected from fishermen in Northern Africa or Mediterranean Sea.
Of course, I live in southern Spain and I know very well that some fishermen are sometimes trawling in Northern Africa, mainly from Morocco.
In fact, I have visited sometimes several harbours there in Málaga, finding there interesting shells and I can say perfectly that you are right: is possible to find several african shells between the nets from the trawlers. In fact, the main source for many african shells like Cymbium cucumis and Murex saharicus are the fishermen operating in Northern Africa, between Morocco and Canary Islands. Myself I have seen Murex saharicus and Cymbium cucumis on nets from these boats. The most interesting trawlers are the ones which are fishing far from Morocco, like Mauritania or even Guinea-Conakry.
Maybe next year we have an appoinment there in Málaga and we have the chance to talk about achatidea. What do you think?
Regards,
Beni
_________________
I started to collect seashells since my childhood but I decided to focus on cowries in 1990. I like all kind of cowries, freaks, normal, nigers, dwarfs...
Also I collect conidae and Muricidae.

[PVDB]

Hello Beni - nice talk

As to a meeting in Malaga next year , would be nice, if possible with my work.

If I understand better now, You speak about genuine founds of achatidea at the Cantabrian Spanish coast - by divers?, beached?, by very local "day-fishermen" sailing out for only a few hours. This is exciting as are the dark pyrum from Cadiz.
Nothing is impossible.
Does it concerns one only shell found or are there more records?

Hoping to hear from You "a.s.a.p."

Kind regards from PVDB.

[PVDB]

Hello Beni - nice talk

As to a meeting in Malaga next year , would be nice, if possible with my work.

If I understand better now, You speak about genuine founds of achatidea at the Cantabrian Spanish coast :
by divers?,
beached?
by dredging?
by very local "day-fishermen" sailing out for only a few hours?
does it concerns one only shell found or are there more records?
at different places?

This is exciting as are the dark pyrum from Cadiz.
Nothing is impossible.

Hoping to hear from You "a.s.a.p."

Kind regards from PVDB.

[benicypraea]

Just for read. this is a reference about achatidea in Northern Spain.

http://jettrigo.iespana.es

Please take a look on "Invertebrados marinos de Galicia"
"Lista de las especies de moluscos de Galicia".

This is a website devoted to marine invertebrates of Galicia (Northwestern Spain). You can read the names of many mediterranean gastropods, even Schilderia achatidea. The list is not exhaustive, but I think that if that name is included here, is because the cowry have been collected there, long time ago or in recent years, I don´t know.
I hope to find more references or aditional info.
Regards,
Beni
_________________
I started to collect seashells since my childhood but I decided to focus on cowries in 1990. I like all kind of cowries, freaks, normal, nigers, dwarfs...
Also I collect conidae and Muricidae.

[Guest]

Dear PVDB:

Next year we´ ll in touch to meet personally there if you have the chance to come again. (If you agree, of course).
Concerning achatidea from Northern Spain, yes, certainly I was speaking about genuine founds there, not unusual findings from Western Africa trawling thanks to fishermen.
About the way to get these shells there, sorry, no idea, at least at this moment, but maybe I can ask to some local people from Galicia.
Probably deep water dredgings in soft bottom are best sources for these shells. I don´t know, but maybe is possible to find in diveable depths. You said it very well: "Nothing is impossible".
Also I remember that I read in a short article about this cowry in the Gulf of Biscay (Golfo de Vizcaya). Also I know that there is a rich marine environment there in Galicia with rather moderate temperature in deeper water. Maybe achatidea has its home there.

Another reference about achatidea: please visit the website

www.eumed.net./malakos/guia/gastro d.html

More, later.
Regards,
Beni

[Bardamu]

Hi all-

This is a good point from Simon. I guess you are talking for all species but species-specific range extremes are also interesting.

Southernmost Cypraea will almost certainly come from Australia, since S Afr is further north (though has a broad continental shelf?) and I don't think you will get much in southern South America.

I have seen a bizarre Notocypraea from deep water (100-200m) off a sea-mount off southern Tasmania. I have also heard that hesitata also occurs in this area.

For NSW there is some good info on cowry distributions at Des Beechey's website www.seashellsofnsw.org.au but I have also done some collecting in this area.

From southern New South Wales: species reported from Twofold Bay include erosa and gracilis (the latter very dead). From Merimbula flaveola and vitellus. From Bermagui clandestina (adult), xanthodon (broken/subfossil?), minoridens (juv), fimbriata (juv), humpherysi (juv). cernica has also been live collected south of Sydney.

Interesting species from northern NSW include hungerfordi, mappa, talpa, stolida, saulae (1), punctata, guttata (beached, dead, ex pisces), etc. Also claimed one specimen of testudinaria and (doubtfully?) hirasei.

Occurence of cowries in far northern NZ (Poor Knights Isl area, etc) is also interesting. I believe vitellus and cernica are reported from here but a few others as well that I cannot recall. I have heard NZ is the type locality
of tesselata, which was assumed to be a mistake, but who knows

Gotta get back to work now.
Best regards
Lynton

[benicypraea]

Hello Bardamu:

I agree. Vitellus and cernica have been recorded from North Island (New Zealand). I have seen several ones from there, rather typical, nothing special in shape or coloration, at least for me.
Tessellata, I don´t know, sincerely, maybe yes, maybe not. However, is a exciting matter!
Luria tessellata neozelandensis????
Regards,
Beni
_________________
I started to collect seashells since my childhood but I decided to focus on cowries in 1990. I like all kind of cowries, freaks, normal, nigers, dwarfs...
Also I collect conidae and Muricidae.

[Sleepycat]

Not long ago I found a website with a surprisingly extensive list of NZ Cypraeidae although it included species present in the Kermadec Islands. However I can't find it now. http://www.molluscs.otago.ac.nz/ lists eight species of which six are Kermadec-only but I thought I had found one with more than that. It may have included "vagrant" records if so (indeed in the intro to http://www.molluscs.otago.ac.nz/ it's mentioned that "vagrant" records of cribraria are excluded.)

[benicypraea]

Hello all:

Maybe luria tessellata lives also in Kermadec Area, it have been recorded from New Caledonia Area, who knows.
I´m sure that the surroundings around NZ is a great place for many other unusual finds.
Regards,
Beni
_________________
I started to collect seashells since my childhood but I decided to focus on cowries in 1990. I like all kind of cowries, freaks, normal, nigers, dwarfs...
Also I collect conidae and Muricidae.